What Is This MESS?!?!?

[ArchAngel]

I find that highly dubious. Did this said poster post any statistics?
Because a random guy on the internet is going up against stats like:
http://www.usgamer.net/articles/next-ge ... n-48-hours" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[ChickenSoup]

Agreed. Also:

Everybody's opinions are valid.

No. No they are not. They are, however, entitled to them

[ccgr]

It's kinda easy to outsell a product that's not available:

http://www.nowinstock.net/videogaming/consoles/ps4/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[DeadManReedeemed]

I find that highly dubious. Did this said poster post any statistics?
Because a random guy on the internet is going up against stats like:
http://www.usgamer.net/articles/next-ge ... n-48-hours" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I heard that the UK isn't Nintendo's main audience. So does that even count?

....Man, I'm tired.....

[ChickenSoup]

I think we're talking overall sales here

[DeadManReedeemed]

I know, but if the UK is not their target audience then why are we counting that?

[LAVA89]

And we're back to my point

Not really. Unless you weren't just talking about hardware gimmicks...which is what I thought you were implying.

My original goal for posting on here was to argue that hardware doesn't affect what people decide to buy in the end as much as the general game trends affect things.

What they need to do is focus on proper hardware rather than gimmicks and recover a name for themselves.

Your argument (from what I gathered from that quote and really all of your posts in this thread): Nintendo needs to make more competitive hardware and stop relying on gimmicks if they want to do better (i.e. gimmicks as in touch screens, motion controls)

My argument: Nintendo just needs to make better games for the Wii U, no matter what the hardware.

[Sstavix]

But you are right in that Nintendo doesn't really have any deeply engrossing, truly moving games. The kind of games that linger with you for hours, days, years afterwards. The kinds of games that really seem to blur the lines between gaming as entertainment and gaming as an artistic medium.

I would disagree with this. My problem isn't with the kind of games that Nintendo usually makes, its that lately they're not even giving us games like Mario Galaxy or Metroid Prime (which to me, were engrossing). Instead alot of the games for the Wii U feels like more like marketing gimmicks.

Let's look at their big games since the Wii U launched:
Legend of Zelda Wind Waker HD? Remake of Wind Waker on the Gamecube
New Super Mario Bros. Wii U? Rehash of New Super Mario Bros. Wii
Nintendoland? (the biggest slap in the face in the Wii U launch) Rehash of Wii Sports (since its basically a tech demo)

Mario 3D World is a good example of this. Having played this game with some friends, I thought it was fun. But what is it really? Mario 3D Land with multiplayer. It definitely doesn't have the dynamic pull Mario Galaxy had. Galaxy made me want to get a Wii. 3D World? Not so much....I'd get it if I'd ever got a Wii U, but it doesn't have the dynamics that Galaxy did.

You say you disagree with me... but pretty much rehash my point. So I agree with you! There really isn't anything engrossing that is exclusively for the WiiU right now. I found Galaxy to be a very fun, entertaining game, but I wouldn't call it truly moving. (Your opinion may vary, of course.) Metroid Prime, yes... but technically since it actually came out for the GameCube originally, you could argue that that doesn't count, either. Likewise, Galaxy (and Galaxy 2) came out first for the Wii, so again, it's not a WiiU exclusive (e.g. if you have a Wii, the game is not an incentive to upgrade).

Fine, I GET IT. Sheesh........

Don't feel bad, man. I know how you feel. Trust me - being a Mac gamer for years now, I know what it's like not to be the target demographic for game developers. I'm sure many Linux users feel the same way (which is likely why the Wine project started in the first place...). Not having a HDTV, we're a niche group that some developers feel aren't the kinds of people that they can profit enough from to make it worth their while.

As a SD TV user, I can sympathize with your feeling left out. Technology is moving at breakneck speeds, and it is hard to keep up. Another example - more and more Macs are shipping without optical drives. This is a trend that does bug me, since I still have games and music on CD/DVD, and I like the option to pop a DVD in my computer to watch it, but at the same time I see how technology is evolving to where everything will be streamed or digital downloads instead of hard media. (It's also why I could see why Microsoft took the "always connected" approach with the Xbox One until the Internet backlash made them change it. I wouldn't be surprise if they try to gradually ease that particular restriction back into play as their customer base gets used to the system.)

Us curmudgeons just need to learn how to adapt to the changes. We don't have to like the changes ("back in my day, our video games only had... And we liked it!") but the alternative is to be left behind. At least you'll be able to swap stories with other dinosaurs, rocking away on the front porch remembering when games were simpler. Which reminds me, have I ever told you about my first computer....

[LAVA89]

You say you disagree with me... but pretty much rehash my point.

Your argument: Nintendo doesn't make engrossing games (how I interpreted your post, though you did leave out the time span you were referring to)

My argument: Nintendo hasn't made any engrossing games LATELY (but did so in the generations prior to the Wii U)

BIG difference

Normally, I as well, dislike it when people say "you're wrong" but end up saying the same thing, but here you have to pay attention to the logical (albeit seemingly slight) differences in our arguments.

[Sstavix]

You say you disagree with me... but pretty much rehash my point.

Your argument: Nintendo doesn't make engrossing games (how I interpreted your post, though you did leave out the time span you were referring to)

My argument: Nintendo hasn't made any engrossing games LATELY (but did so in the generations prior to the Wii U)

BIG difference

Normally, I as well, dislike it when people say "you're wrong" but end up saying the same thing, but here you have to pay attention to the logical (albeit seemingly slight) differences in our arguments.

Ah, I see. I was misinterpreted. Yes, Nintendo has made some pretty engrossing games - I still have fond memories of "A Link to the Past," for example. But yeah, lately (e.g. this generation of consoles) their content has been quite lacking.

[LAVA89]

Ok, cool. I stand corrected, then.

Did you like any of the games on the Wii?

[ChickenSoup]

I know, but if the UK is not their target audience then why are we counting that?

because the UK is part of worldwide sales...?

[Sstavix]

Did you like any of the games on the Wii?

Oh, yes. I'm a big Mario Kart junkie, so that's pretty much a given (in fact, that game is one big incentive for me to get one of their handheld systems... one of these days...). Smash Bros. Brawl is pretty good, too. I played the Metroid Prime games and Twilight Princess on that console, and while they are technically imports from the GameCube era, I still enjoyed them quite a bit. Galaxy was a blast (I haven't played the second one yet), and I just finished Kirby's Epic Yarn (I played that one when the kids were around because they wanted to watch. Most of the time, though, I wait until the kids are in bed before playing, since some scenes in games like Metroid Prime or the Zelda games may be a bit too intense for them). I've even enjoyed Wii Fit Plus as an alternative to a workout routine.

But some of Nintendo's games I also found aggravating, too. I haven't made it too far into Skyward Sword, for example, because I've been finding the boss battles to be more frustrating than entertaining - which is really too bad, because boss battles are often the most entertaining portion of most games. They feel more like a chore to me - something to get over with as quickly as possible so I can get back to the story - and that's just sad. I love to have a boss fight where, after it's over, my first reaction is "let's do that AGAIN!" In some of the Metroid games, I've done just that - restart the system just to fight that same boss a second time.

However, I'd be hard-pressed to say what games for the Wii are deeply moving and memorable. Fun, yes. But nothing comes to mind that makes me sit back after the game is over and just say "wow...." Then again, the games that I enjoy most and find memorable tend to be those with really solid storylines. Something that compels me to keep playing because I want to find out what happens next. Casual games - such as the Mario Party series, Wii Music or abstract strategy games like Bejeweled - don't generally allow for that. Nintendo had focused a lot on the casual gamer for the Wii, so while there are entertaining games for the Wii, I can't really think of any games that are truly compelling.

Does that make sense?

[ChickenSoup]

Yeah, and what bums me out is that Zelda games are still some of the few games I played through to the finish because the endings, though still "you saved the Princess/World again!", it was always so dang satisfying, and not just because it was hard to win.

I think a lot of games on Nintendo's latest consoles may be FUN, but it usually doesn't go deeper than that. At least, not in my experience. I mostly got annoyed at Twilight Princess because, no matter what your view of "button mashing" is, sitting there shaking the controller to swing the stupid sword.

[Sstavix]

I mostly got annoyed at Twilight Princess because, no matter what your view of "button mashing" is, sitting there shaking the controller to swing the stupid sword.

I actually enjoyed that aspect of the game, maybe because it was different from "Push the B button to swing your sword." But to each their own.