SNL attacks Christianity

[ccgr]

thoughts?

[ArcticFox]

Keepin' it classy, SNL.

[ChickenSoup]

"Attacks a case study of the American right" =/= "attacks Christianity"


I think it was a little heavy-handed and the title of the movie as a punchline was too purposefully outrageous, but some parts had me cracking up ("Christians are the most persecuted group in America!" "...maybe...").

[ArcticFox]

"Attacks a case study of the American right" =/= "attacks Christianity"

Despite the popular media rhetoric, that was no case study of the American right. I don't know anyone who wants to deny basic services to gay people... but that's the mantra we hear all the time. That video also hints at the idea that the American right is anti-semitic, which is absurd when you consider it's the American left that hates Israel and right-wingers tend to be in support of it. The video might have served as satire except that the claims and criticisms of Christianity were prettymuch a list of HuffPo talking points, and don't represent any Conservatives or Christians I know.

[ArchAngel]

Apart from being uncharacteristically funny of SNL, it sits as a good parody of a lot of poor rhetoric from the religious right (i.e. the compendium of logical fallacies that is God's Not Dead). This is not pointed at Christianity in general, but the kind that likes to paint itself as a cringing minority. So they painted that very farcical world.

[ArcticFox]

This is not pointed at Christianity in general, but the kind that likes to paint itself as a cringing minority. So they painted that very farcical world.

You think the average SNL viewer is going to get that distinction?

In any case, I'm not convinced at all that their intent was to lampoon a small group. These are the very same talking points you see every time a gay marriage debate appears. This is what the SNL crowd honestly thinks most Christians do and think.

[Deepfreeze32]

That video also hints at the idea that the American right is anti-semitic, which is absurd when you consider it's the American left that hates Israel and right-wingers tend to be in support of it.

So being opposed to the actions of a country that happens to be primarily Jewish is anti-semitic? I'm pretty sure that's not what you meant, that but seems to be the implication of that statement (And is a belief held by some people I know...). I did think the Jewish bit was in poor taste, though.

I'm not a super pro-Israel person (Primarily because Israel in the bible [God's chosen people] is not the Israel of today[A geopolitical entity]), but I think "hates Israel" is pushing hyperbole a bit much. Are there people who actually hate Israel? Sure, but to paint half of the political spectrum with that broad a brush is no better than what SNL did here. It's like saying the American Right hates black people, a thing the internet (I hesitate to say media given the propagation of blogs and such) is wont to do. Are there some who do? Yeah. Does that make it accurate or a fair assessment? No!

Besides, this SNL skit (In my interpretation) is clearly lampooning the wave of Christian "feel-good" movies that are seeing wide release (Right down to the terrible representation of atheist/gay/OTHERS those movies have), not actual Christians. This is sooooo obviously a parody of God's Not Dead 2, especially the trailer. I mean, if this is attacking Christians, then Atheists should feel attacked by God's Not Dead for treating them just as bad as this skit treats Christians.

Although I think I ultimately agree with souperman on this: "I think it was a little heavy-handed and the title of the movie as a punchline was too purposefully outrageous." 6/10, 8/10 with rice.

[ChickenSoup]

What can I say. SNL doesn't know how to end a sketch

[Yantelope]

The best way I can think to highlight the philosophical contradictions in this video is to ask you to watch it again. This time picture a white Christian couple in an Islamic kitchen. They kindly ask the Muslim to butcher a pig for them. The video could carry on from there in exactly the same way. I'm confident the liberal left would agree that the Muslims should just get over their petty religious objections to a simple animal that everyone knows is fine to eat right? How dare they refuse to serve pork, a basic good and service! Outrage!

[Lazarus]

The best way I can think to highlight the philosophical contradictions in this video is to ask you to watch it again. This time picture a white Christian couple in an Islamic kitchen. They kindly ask the Muslim to butcher a pig for them. The video could carry on from there in exactly the same way. I'm confident the liberal left would agree that the Muslims should just get over their petty religious objections to a simple animal that everyone knows is fine to eat right? How dare they refuse to serve pork, a basic good and service! Outrage!

Nope, ridiculous. Tons of government regulations and inspections must be followed and passed for any food processor to butcher pigs. You can't just do it willy-nilly unless a business is specifically set up to do so with the government's involvement. It requires many hours of work just to set up, and it costs a fortune. How do I know? I'm a butcher! I cut up pigs every day. I fill out tons of paperwork every day. My boss has a nightmare to go through just to keep up with the state inspections and changing regulations.

Baking a cake is not even comparable.

Furthermore, a bakery sells cakes and baked goods by definition. An "Islamic kitchen", which is a very poor choice of words, has no such mandate.

Poor analogy, clear overtones of religious bigotry... you're probably part of the group SNL is putting in the hot seat with this sketch.

Personally I just love - LOVE that you used this example of all the examples you could have picked. Pork is unclean to eat, literally according to the Holy Bible. Jesus Himself wouldn't have touched or eaten a pig! I laughed harder about this than the SNL skit!

By the way, "white Christian couple"? There are many white Muslims. This analogy went to a weird racial place for no obvious reason.

[ArcticFox]

So being opposed to the actions of a country that happens to be primarily Jewish is anti-semitic? I'm pretty sure that's not what you meant, that but seems to be the implication of that statement (And is a belief held by some people I know...). I did think the Jewish bit was in poor taste, though.

I won't speak for everyone, but a good bit of the opposition to Israel is based on anti-semitism, and that is from some people I know. All of them on the American political left.

I'm not a super pro-Israel person (Primarily because Israel in the bible [God's chosen people] is not the Israel of today[A geopolitical entity]), but I think "hates Israel" is pushing hyperbole a bit much. Are there people who actually hate Israel? Sure, but to paint half of the political spectrum with that broad a brush is no better than what SNL did here. It's like saying the American Right hates black people, a thing the internet (I hesitate to say media given the propagation of blogs and such) is wont to do. Are there some who do? Yeah. Does that make it accurate or a fair assessment? No!

I'll concede that the statement was too broad, sure. It is the trend I've observed however.

Besides, this SNL skit (In my interpretation) is clearly lampooning the wave of Christian "feel-good" movies that are seeing wide release (Right down to the terrible representation of atheist/gay/OTHERS those movies have), not actual Christians. This is sooooo obviously a parody of God's Not Dead 2, especially the trailer. I mean, if this is attacking Christians, then Atheists should feel attacked by God's Not Dead for treating them just as bad as this skit treats Christians.

I haven't seen God's Not Dead 2 so I can't comment, but even if I were to accept that such a movie were a direct attack on Atheists, at least that movie isn't meant for a national, across-the-board audience. SNL is, and like I said, I don't think most of the fans are making the distinction you are.

You guys are defending this skit on the grounds that it's only attacking a small portion of American Christians and what I'm telling you is there are plenty of people who will NOT see it that way and will see it as being directed against all Christians, because that's exactly how we're portrayed in left-leaning news media. It's like that case with the bakery in CO all over again. They never refused service to gay people, but anyone and everyone with an axe to grind against them will say they did, and they're not interested in differentiating between Christians who really do hate homosexuals and those who don't. That means a lie is being perpetuated and you'll just have to forgive me if I'm not comfortable with that.

You remember that popular quote from Sarah Palin saying "I can see Russia from my house!" We heard that lampooned plenty during the 2008 election, if you'll remember. Well turns out, Sarah Palin never said that. Tina Fey said it on SNL while doing a skit impersonating Palin, and audiences soon forgot the actual source. Even Wolf Blitzer of almighty CNN was quoting Sarah Palin as saying that, when she never did. (What she actually said, and what SNL was lampooning, was that from certain parts of Alaska, it's possible to see mainland Russia on a clear day, which is a true statement.)

So go ahead and push the notion that this stuff is harmless if you want to. I don't see it that way. We live in a time when a significant portion of people get their news from comedians like Colbert and Stewart. So go ahead and tell me it's okay because TV audiences are sophisticated enough to get the finer points of this satire.

[IBJamon]

I can usually laugh at most things, even when it makes fun of myself and my 'kind', but I did not find this funny, but spiteful. I am disappoint.

Being forced to support something that is clearly sin is a real and serious civil rights issue that some courts have decided to ignore, though I am not so heartless as to not understand why this issue is difficult regardless. They do make some good points (we are hardly persecuted in this country) and I can understand how atheists would think God's Not Dead is a rather unfair portrayal of them (I watched it, I am the target audience, and I thought it was also).

I have not read any commentary on this video, so I don't know what they are saying. All I heard was a small blip on Christian radio that said SNL made a skit bashing Christians. They said no more and I heard no more about it until I watched this.

IBJamon

[Yantelope]

Nope, ridiculous. Tons of government regulations and inspections must be followed and passed for any food processor to butcher pigs. You can't just do it willy-nilly unless a business is specifically set up to do so with the government's involvement. It requires many hours of work just to set up, and it costs a fortune. How do I know? I'm a butcher! I cut up pigs every day. I fill out tons of paperwork every day. My boss has a nightmare to go through just to keep up with the state inspections and changing regulations.

Baking a cake is not even comparable.

Furthermore, a bakery sells cakes and baked goods by definition. An "Islamic kitchen", which is a very poor choice of words, has no such mandate.

Poor analogy, clear overtones of religious bigotry... you're probably part of the group SNL is putting in the hot seat with this sketch.

Personally I just love - LOVE that you used this example of all the examples you could have picked. Pork is unclean to eat, literally according to the Holy Bible. Jesus Himself wouldn't have touched or eaten a pig! I laughed harder about this than the SNL skit!

By the way, "white Christian couple"? There are many white Muslims. This analogy went to a weird racial place for no obvious reason.

In an effort to simplify the analogy, do you think Jewish or Islamic restaurants or delis or butchers or whatever should be forced to prepare meats that would violate their religious beliefs?

[Lazarus]

Wait, did you even read my post? You can't just start preparing and selling new kinds of meat at a shop out of the blue, even if you wanted to.

Anyway, this is missing the point. These shops are not selling those meats in the first place. The bakery IS selling the cakes. You're comparing the government forcing you to sell your own products to "undesirables", to a situation where the government forces you to start selling a product you didn't even have. Totally different.

That scenario doesn't make sense for other reasons too. The kind of person who would sue over a Jewish shop not selling them pork is probably someone who wouldn't buy anything in a Jewish shop in the first place.

[ChickenSoup]

I can't take this discussion seriously if we keep calling this an attack. It reminds me of when people used to claim that the Simpsons was an attack on the idea of the American family.

You remember that popular quote from Sarah Palin saying "I can see Russia from my house!" We heard that lampooned plenty during the 2008 election, if you'll remember. Well turns out, Sarah Palin never said that. Tina Fey said it on SNL while doing a skit impersonating Palin, and audiences soon forgot the actual source. Even Wolf Blitzer of almighty CNN was quoting Sarah Palin as saying that, when she never did. (What she actually said, and what SNL was lampooning, was that from certain parts of Alaska, it's possible to see mainland Russia on a clear day, which is a true statement.)

Regardless, Fey nailed the impression that Palin is a few pews short of a full church. It isn't SNL's fault that people took one line and ran with it.

So go ahead and push the notion that this stuff is harmless if you want to. I don't see it that way. We live in a time when a significant portion of people get their news from comedians like Colbert and Stewart. So go ahead and tell me it's okay because TV audiences are sophisticated enough to get the finer points of this satire.

Hey man, those guys are awesome! And... also one of them is currently running a rehab farm for (IIRC) abused farm animals. And the other is on CBS. REGARDLESS, I don't see what your point is. Those guys are pretty sharp dudes, anyway, and they have a pretty good eye for politics [that most conservatives would disagree with, etc. etc.]

In all seriousness, what is your argument? That we remove satire from TV? That people probably shouldn't put messages out on TV that might be misinterpreted? What, we're supposed to make it even dumber than it already is? I'm surprised that I actually laughed at something SNL produced.. They ninja-mocked the idea that Christians were the most persecuted group in America not only to satire rhetoric from that particular demographic, but also (conceivably) to smirk at the inevitable backlash that the sketch would receive from that rhetoric after its publication. SNL hasn't been that clever in a long time, enough to make me wonder if it was mostly luck.