Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

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ImperialR
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Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby ImperialR » Tue Sep 20, 2016 1:02 am

So it turns out the Game Theorists channel has a video, that I haven't even watched, just so you know, about if Final Fantasy is anti-Christianity.

And it started to click.

Ever notice what summoning monsters are named and based off of?

Odin, Shiva, Baal, the only one I can remember the name of that isn't generic like "unicorn" or like that, is Alexander, and even then, he was one of the worshiped like a god sort of leaders.


Another theme present from the very first game, crystals. Crystals are, as you may know, a part of new age religions, and the concept of magic crystals being a macguffin, or used to summon previously mentioned monsters, can be singled out through the series.

boss of the first game is a "demon king", second game's villain is an emperor who split his soul and dares to try to rule over heaven and hell, in FF IV: The After Years, you fight a character called "the creator" who well...Take a guess of what is going on there. Sephiroth, literally wants to be a god, and to destroy the world. FF8, time traveling witch possessing a woman and wants um...Time compression? more than one boss across the serious that wants to make the world into nothingness. the villain in FFX who is a church leader who wants to "become sin" (which the sin they talk about is...a giant flying whale.) In 13, the boss is a creature that plays god with every man woman and child in it's domain, branding some, who will turn into monsters if they don't do it's will, and if they do what it wants, they are in-cased in crystal to..."live forever". Even in tactics, villain is "the bloody angel", one boss is worshiped as a "saint", Legends 2, with bosses named Venus and Apollo...I could go on, I literally was finding some of this out right before I wrote it here.

And of course the obvious occult symbolism in magic, and how heavy on magic these games are, but seriously, even the main plot of games can be a little suspect. (cloning, FF7 and FF9, corrupting objects, FF tactics, crystals to save humanity, multiple games.)

There was some stuff I didn't even mention. :?

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby Kyuremu » Tue Sep 20, 2016 2:19 am

I wouldn't call it anti-christian. They're high-fantasy video games that incorporate real world mythologies into monster designs and summons themselves. I think you're looking a bit too far into proving the franchise is somehow turning people against God. Interesting theory nonetheless on your part.

I mean you could draw out that Ganon is the devil in the TLoZ series. Anything is possible when you actively look for connections.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby ImperialR » Tue Sep 20, 2016 2:35 am

I wouldn't call it anti-christian. They're high-fantasy video games that incorporate real world mythologies into monster designs and summons themselves. I think you're looking a bit too far into proving the franchise is somehow turning people against God. Interesting theory nonetheless on your part.

I mean you could draw out that Ganon is the devil in the TLoZ series. Anything is possible when you actively look for connections.

I think it's weirdly specific how often it involves fighting a god character or "creator". I'm not trying to prove turning people against God, don't get me wrong, it's a nice game series, and I like 9 actually, but some things just seem like they're trying to communicate something.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby Kyuremu » Tue Sep 20, 2016 2:45 am

Nearly every religion has a "creator" it's not uncommon for games to incorporate those legends, but you never fight a creator type character in FF. The antagonist is usually someone (a mortal creature) trying to attain ultimate power. It's literally Good vs. Evil just told different ways in each game.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby ImperialR » Tue Sep 20, 2016 3:09 am

Nearly every religion has a "creator" it's not uncommon for games to incorporate those legends, but you never fight a creator type character in FF. The antagonist is usually someone (a mortal creature) trying to attain ultimate power. It's literally Good vs. Evil just told different ways in each game.

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/List ... fter_Years

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/List ... asy_Legend

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby Kyuremu » Tue Sep 20, 2016 3:53 am

Very interesting, looking at your examples I would call it anti-religous to an extent as no particular faith is attributed. And to be honest I've actually never played any of the FF Legend games and only played part of the story in IV: The After Years on the Wii. (What a joke paying for the game only to be told you have to buy every other episode)

It is honestly the past decade of playing games like this that I've become so used to the trope of killing a god or a god-like being.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby ChaoHellsing » Tue Nov 07, 2017 10:49 pm

One thing to keep in mind is that they are not approaching creation from a Christian standpoint. Be that as it may, I've felt true embarrassment when dealing with some of the "spiritual" aspects of the Final Fantasy series.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby HelenDavisM » Tue May 21, 2019 3:41 pm

I don't agree. The 'gods' in the game act more like Satan. I found some similarities in Final Fantasy V to the Millenial Reign in Revelation, with the monsters being sealed for 1000 years.

Also, here is a guest article I did for a Catholic website.

http://catholicvideogamers.blogspot.com ... eview.html

Now, I find Final Fantasy 9 to be disturbing. Breath of Fire 2 is explicitly anti-Christian.

But as for Final Fantasy? Not so much. It's good vs evil.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby GethN7 » Wed May 22, 2019 11:35 am

I don't agree. The 'gods' in the game act more like Satan. I found some similarities in Final Fantasy V to the Millenial Reign in Revelation, with the monsters being sealed for 1000 years.

Also, here is a guest article I did for a Catholic website.

http://catholicvideogamers.blogspot.com ... eview.html

Now, I find Final Fantasy 9 to be disturbing. Breath of Fire 2 is explicitly anti-Christian.

But as for Final Fantasy? Not so much. It's good vs evil.

Breath of Fire 2 is basically taking the whole "twisted evil parody of a church" theme and running with it.

Part of the reason it comes off as anti-Christian is the absolutely terrible translation, but the Church of Eva is basically a religion of evil wearing the skin suit of a Christian style church, you are meant to be disgusted at their hypocrisy, that's the entire point.


Final Fantasy VI's "gods" are basically more a neutral than explicitly good or evil element. They were passive entities outside their backstory role of creating everything magical, and only attained an evil purpose once they were corrupted by a third party, but they otherwise did nothing save create the backdrop the story takes place in the lore.


Final Fantasy V has a "devils but no God" theme going, where most supernatural beings are at best neutral and at worst downright evil. The main villain is basically a soul twisted by evil corrupted by demons like Legion in the Gospels.


Final Fantasy Legend's "Creator" is basically a dark parody of the Christian God, only one that set up the Tower of Babel stand-in just to jerk all the other subordinate worlds connected to it around, and when he offers you his version of salvation, it's basically a callous way of saying "Well, you're the first ones to actually reach me, here's a prize for it".

He basically comes off a god like being who doesn't really care about anything he created, it's a massive game to him, hence why your characters turn on him. As an amusing game oversight, the Chainsaw weapon can one shot him, so you can basically kill "god" with a chainsaw, and since the IRL God is nowhere near that pathetic, you are basically taking out an amoral parody of the real deal, but given the lack of any real system of morals attached to his character, he's more a generic "apathetic at best, abusive at worst" Creator like figure than anything based on any actual religion.

The original Japanese translation makes it clear he considers everything a game and a floor of the tower shows he's even recording the "high scores' of those who tried to reach him. He's basically an amoral jerk, not a moral figure stand-in.



FFIV: The After Years features a "god like being with mad scientist pretensions" theme that most fantasy series with an infusion of sci-fi tend to go for.

Basically, the "Creator" is treating their creations like experiments and wants to off the failed ones and start over. They aren't a moral figure (save in their own minds), just a superpowered mad scientist with the belief creating something makes their wishes for said creations divine level edicts.


Final Fantasy IX is another twist on "mad scientist with pretensions of godhood" idea, only the original creators of one planet are basically trying to hijack another to extend their own lives and you never fight them per se (they are long gone), only their agents who have their own goals. The final boss, Necron, he's a a wild card element who doesn't really fit into a good/evil axis, he just exists to return all that dies to the grave for his own reasons.

Given how the villains prior to him were deliberately messing with the rules of life and death for their own purposes, he's basically a neutral third party who wants the meddling to stop for his own reasons. In the original game concept, the bonus boss Hades (based after the Greek deity of the underworld) was at one point intended to fill this role, but he was made a bonus boss with no story importance instead.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby HelenDavisM » Thu May 23, 2019 8:03 pm

I don't agree. The 'gods' in the game act more like Satan. I found some similarities in Final Fantasy V to the Millenial Reign in Revelation, with the monsters being sealed for 1000 years.

Also, here is a guest article I did for a Catholic website.

http://catholicvideogamers.blogspot.com ... eview.html

Now, I find Final Fantasy 9 to be disturbing. Breath of Fire 2 is explicitly anti-Christian.

But as for Final Fantasy? Not so much. It's good vs evil.

Breath of Fire 2 is basically taking the whole "twisted evil parody of a church" theme and running with it.

Part of the reason it comes off as anti-Christian is the absolutely terrible translation, but the Church of Eva is basically a religion of evil wearing the skin suit of a Christian style church, you are meant to be disgusted at their hypocrisy, that's the entire point.


Final Fantasy VI's "gods" are basically more a neutral than explicitly good or evil element. They were passive entities outside their backstory role of creating everything magical, and only attained an evil purpose once they were corrupted by a third party, but they otherwise did nothing save create the backdrop the story takes place in the lore.


Final Fantasy V has a "devils but no God" theme going, where most supernatural beings are at best neutral and at worst downright evil. The main villain is basically a soul twisted by evil corrupted by demons like Legion in the Gospels.


Final Fantasy Legend's "Creator" is basically a dark parody of the Christian God, only one that set up the Tower of Babel stand-in just to jerk all the other subordinate worlds connected to it around, and when he offers you his version of salvation, it's basically a callous way of saying "Well, you're the first ones to actually reach me, here's a prize for it".

He basically comes off a god like being who doesn't really care about anything he created, it's a massive game to him, hence why your characters turn on him. As an amusing game oversight, the Chainsaw weapon can one shot him, so you can basically kill "god" with a chainsaw, and since the IRL God is nowhere near that pathetic, you are basically taking out an amoral parody of the real deal, but given the lack of any real system of morals attached to his character, he's more a generic "apathetic at best, abusive at worst" Creator like figure than anything based on any actual religion.

The original Japanese translation makes it clear he considers everything a game and a floor of the tower shows he's even recording the "high scores' of those who tried to reach him. He's basically an amoral jerk, not a moral figure stand-in.



FFIV: The After Years features a "god like being with mad scientist pretensions" theme that most fantasy series with an infusion of sci-fi tend to go for.

Basically, the "Creator" is treating their creations like experiments and wants to off the failed ones and start over. They aren't a moral figure (save in their own minds), just a superpowered mad scientist with the belief creating something makes their wishes for said creations divine level edicts.


Final Fantasy IX is another twist on "mad scientist with pretensions of godhood" idea, only the original creators of one planet are basically trying to hijack another to extend their own lives and you never fight them per se (they are long gone), only their agents who have their own goals. The final boss, Necron, he's a a wild card element who doesn't really fit into a good/evil axis, he just exists to return all that dies to the grave for his own reasons.

Given how the villains prior to him were deliberately messing with the rules of life and death for their own purposes, he's basically a neutral third party who wants the meddling to stop for his own reasons. In the original game concept, the bonus boss Hades (based after the Greek deity of the underworld) was at one point intended to fill this role, but he was made a bonus boss with no story importance instead.
I didn't realize how the translation affected BOF2. Is it worth getting a better translated port to see that?

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby GethN7 » Thu May 23, 2019 10:20 pm

I didn't realize how the translation affected BOF2. Is it worth getting a better translated port to see that?
A better translation does make the game much more understandable, and it's made much more obvious that the Church of Eva is riddled with evil while preaching otherwise. The original translation muddles this point and makes this more uncertain early on, as well as obscuring lots of other plot points with with all sorts of Engrish.

You'd have to get a revised translation patch for a legal copy of the game, all official versions still have the original terrible translations.

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Re: Final Fantasy's terrible truth?

Postby Joshua19 » Tue May 28, 2019 3:44 am

Do you guys know if there is anything antichristian in Final Fintasy 14 (the MMO)?
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